Browns Thread: 'Twas fun while it lasted

Discussion in 'The Mainboard' started by Corch, Apr 9, 2015.

  1. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    I don't love it; but I too can live with it. I'm not interested in paying Cousins $30M; but $13M for McCarron for a couple years while Darnold is developed is feasible...and gives us flexibility on the roster to get a CB, S and WR in free agency.
     
  2. phunkybuck

    phunkybuck Your pennies have been in my ass
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    Can't fathom that Hue was going to give away a 2nd and 3rd for a guy who couldn't beat out Andy Dalton and would become a free agent two month later. Thank you Sashi for falling on the sword.
     
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  3. HotMic

    HotMic PopTart Mascot Enthusiast
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  4. Principal McVicker

    Principal McVicker Not so New Member
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    He's coaching for his job. With the way he has Haslam's ear, I put nothing past him. I'm meh on Zampese but I do like Haley.
     
  5. tradercane

    tradercane Well-Known Member

    Why would you want to waste 30 million a year on a guy that has proven that he can't win a big game and is at best a middle of the road starting QB. The smart thing to do is draft a guy and hope that he becomes a franchise QB. For me the top guy is Darnold but I would trust Dorsey to pick the right guy.

    If Dorsey believes in Mayfield you can still trade the first pick to the Jets and pick Mayfield 4th and still have the 6th pick plus Jamal Adams and the Jets first round pick in 2019. Signing Cousins makes no sense for teams like the Browns or Jets but I think he is going to end up in New York because the Jets GM is scared to death to move up and get a franchise QB.
     
  6. tradercane

    tradercane Well-Known Member

    Really you guys should be excited because Dorsey is a real solid GM and Hue should be done after next season.
     
  7. mp_22

    mp_22 Well-Known Member
    Duke Blue DevilsPhiladelphia PhilliesLos Angeles RamsPhiladelphia FlyersSouthern California Trojans

    Can anyone give me Dorsey’s draft history?
     
  8. Bert Handsome

    Bert Handsome I'm sorry, the card says Moops
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    Look at KC the last few years. Before that in GB. They had really good drafts in Green Bay during his tenure but it was always TT making the final call.
     
  9. Bill the Butcher

    Bill the Butcher Roscoe's favorite poster
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    Pretty avg tbh.
     
  10. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
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    Its really good

    Hth
     
  11. Marty Kaan

    Marty Kaan By any means necessary
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    Mediocre is better than perennial bottom feeder
     
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  12. Marty Kaan

    Marty Kaan By any means necessary
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    Def below average
     
  13. HotMic

    HotMic PopTart Mascot Enthusiast
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    Hope that answers your question.
     
  14. lfriend

    lfriend Well-Known Member
    Missouri TigersKansas City Chiefs

    2013:
    -Fisher is below average, but still one of the better top half first picks. Woof.
    -Kelce was a great find, but also had inside track via his brother obv.
    -lolkniledavis
    -Rest is whatevs

    2014:
    Scooped up a solid RG in Frenchy and a decent backup Center with Zach Fulton in the 6th round.

    Rest of the draft was awful, including a pretty bad reach with Dee Ford in the 1st.

    2015:
    His best draft, which also had the most picks he's used.

    -Peters was a good choice, but an obv one if you were willing to bet on the headcase.
    -Mitch Morse was a good grab in the 2nd round, first time he had a 2nd rounder in KC.
    -Chris Conley and Nelson were solid 3rd rounders.
    -Drafted a pro bowl special teamer in the 5th.
    -Solid rotational DL guy at the end.

    2016:
    -Traded out of the first for extra picks and took Chris Jones early 2nd. Good pick.
    -Moved down again so the Bucs could get that 2nd round kicker lmbo (best Dorsey move). KC moved down a lot because they lost their original 3rd because they suck at tampering with FAs.
    -Tyreek Hill was a massive gamble in the 5th and probably his worst (dv reasons) best decision.
    -Rest of draft was trash.

    Way too early to judge the kind of draft they had in 2017.

    I'd say he's at least average, which is a massive improvement for Cleveland. He's definitely an old school kind of scout and will do just fine if he has nothing to do with managing the cap and some other GM duties.

    Just let him find talent and churn the bottom of the roster.

    On a sidenote, he passed on AJ McCarron in the '14 draft for Aaron Murry. If the QB stable is under his control, don't be surprised if AJ isn't a Brown.
     
  15. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    He started drafting before 2013
     
  16. lfriend

    lfriend Well-Known Member
    Missouri TigersKansas City Chiefs

    No, he did not.
     
  17. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    Uh yeah man he did
     
  18. lfriend

    lfriend Well-Known Member
    Missouri TigersKansas City Chiefs

    So what team did he run before the Chiefs?

    He wasn't running the Packers war room for Ted Thompson.
     
    #2619 lfriend, Feb 17, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2018
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  19. dblplay1212

    dblplay1212 Well-Known Member
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    AJ gonna win a playoff game or two for y'all.
     
  20. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    He was director of college scouting in GB from 2000-2011, and is credited with evaluating guys like Aaron Rodgers, Greg Jennings, Clay Matthews, etc..

    Snippet from Dorsey's 1st year as GM in Kansas City:

    Kansas City Chiefs: No team has been more active in free agency than Kansas City and first-time general manager John Dorsey, which started with the acquisition of Alex Smith before free agency began. The Chiefs have done well for themselves, picking up the top corner available in Sean Smith, speedy wideout Donnie Avery, defensive lineman Mike DeVito, quarterback Chase Daniel and tight end Anthony Fasano, among others. I'm not a huge fan of the Dunta Robinson signing, so Kansas City gets a little knock there, but not much considering it's basically a one-year deal. Grade: A

    In 2015, he signed WR, Jeremy Maclin.
    In 2016, he signed OT, Mitchell Schwartz

    In Green Bay, at one point, every player on the two deep was drafted by Green Bay. That is amazing. Dorsey was director of college scouting from 2000-2011; and director of football ops in 2012.

    GB Draft w/ Dorsey evaluating:

    2011: WR, Randall Cobb
    2010: OT, Bryan Bulaga, S Morgan Burnett, RB James Starks (6th round)
    2009: DT, BJ Raji, LB Clay Matthews,
    2008: WR, Jordy Nelson (2nd round)
    2007: WR, James Jones (3rd round)
    2006: WR, Greg Jennings (2nd round)
    2005: QB, Aaron Rodgers, S, Nick Collins
    2003: LB, Nick Barnett
    2002: RB, Najeh Davenport (4th Round)
    2000: TE, Bubba Franks,

    He has some nice finds and obviously, based on GB being built completely through the draft. overall did an outstanding job. Really exciting as it relates to this year's draft and all of our assets.

    One thing we don't know is who will be Franchised and who will ultimately his the market as an UFA. But some guys who might be of interest.

    - Dorsey signed QB Chase McDaniel in 2013 in KC. If things don't work out with McCarron, it wouldn't shock me he is our stop-gap QB.
    - Dorsey signed WR Albert Wilson as an undrafted Free agent in 2014.
    - Dorsey drafted S Morgan Burnett (current starting Safety in GB) in 2010.
     
  21. mp_22

    mp_22 Well-Known Member
    Duke Blue DevilsPhiladelphia PhilliesLos Angeles RamsPhiladelphia FlyersSouthern California Trojans

    Browns gonna sign McCarron and draft a QB
     
  22. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    His job in green bay was almost only 'tell us who to draft'
     
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  23. WC

    WC Bad Company, ‘til the day I die.
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    Browns gonna Chubb or nah?
     
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  24. Corch

    Corch My son got the Denver Nuggets jeans
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    Probably not but we will continue to Matthew Dayes.
     
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  25. WC

    WC Bad Company, ‘til the day I die.
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    These are truly the best of Dayes
     
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  26. Homo Erectus

    Homo Erectus The important thing is, you think I'm attractive
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    Dorsey was a little hit or miss drafting, but he did do a decent job pulling guys like Hunt, Hill, etc in the middle rounds.
     
  27. mjkstl

    mjkstl Well-Known Member

    If anyone is looking for a mock draft simulator, on the clock at fanspeak is one place.

    I've been taking N Chubb & Fitzpatrick lately. That website isn't perfect. I've seen the QB Falk go anywhere from late 1st all the way to late 5th round.
     
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  28. Principal McVicker

    Principal McVicker Not so New Member
    Cleveland BrownsColumbus Blue JacketsColumbus CrewCleveland CavaliersCleveland Indians

    Here is what I came up with using the NFL.com ratings

    1: R1P1
    QB JOSH ROSEN
    UCLA

    4: R1P4
    RB SAQUON BARKLEY
    PENN STATE

    33: R2P1
    CB DENZEL WARD
    OHIO STATE

    35: R2P3
    EDGE SAM HUBBARD
    OHIO STATE

    64: R2P32
    WR CHRISTIAN KIRK
    TEXAS A&M

    65: R3P1
    G BRENDAN MAHON
    PENN ST

    103: R4P1
    WR SIMMIE COBBS JR.
    INDIANA

    125: R4P23
    CB KEVIN TOLIVER II
    LSU

    140: R5P1
    RB RASHAAD PENNY
    SDSU

    161: R5P22
    TE TROY FUMAGALLI
    WISCONSIN

    178: R6P1
    DL MIKE RAMSAY
    DUKE

    219: R7P1
    WR EQUANIMEOUS ST. BROWN
    NOTRE DAME
     
  29. SugarShaun

    SugarShaun A man of many hobbies
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  30. yaywaffles

    yaywaffles cheese monster
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    i can't imagine ward falls out of the first round unless he just bombs the combine or something
     
  31. HotMic

    HotMic PopTart Mascot Enthusiast
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    Go home NFL.com ratings, you are drunk.
     
  32. Bill the Butcher

    Bill the Butcher Roscoe's favorite poster
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    I have no idea how people are rating kirk that low.
     
  33. mjkstl

    mjkstl Well-Known Member

    Brown is another one whose draft position is crazy.

    I think AJ McCarron will get a 4 year 72 million deal with 36 to 40 guaranteed.
     
  34. mjkstl

    mjkstl Well-Known Member

    I tried taking Rosen at 1-1 and Mayfield at 1-4. I still got Falk at 6-1. One of the 3 will work out right?
     
  35. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
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    Why
     
  36. HotMic

    HotMic PopTart Mascot Enthusiast
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    Because Stone Cold says so.
     
  37. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    But what about stone cold et
     
  38. HotMic

    HotMic PopTart Mascot Enthusiast
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    [​IMG]
     
  39. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    Doubtful. It will most likely be in the Glennon range.

    Mike Glennon signed a 3 year, $45,000,000 contract with the Chicago Bears, including a $3,000,000 signing bonus, $18,500,000 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $15,000,000. In 2018, Glennon will earn a base salary of $12,500,000 and a roster bonus of $2,500,000, while carrying a cap hit of $16,000,000 and a dead cap value of $4,500,000.
     
  40. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    It seems to be a common thought that there are 3-4 QB's who are a possibility for Cleveland at #1 - Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen & Allen. Let's compare those QB's in some key statistical categories...and maybe throw a couple others in for good measure.

    Adjusted completion percentage:
    1. (1) Baker Mayfield - 79.8%
    2. (6) Sam Darnold - 75.8%
    3. (21) Josh Rosen - 71.6%
    4. (22) Mason Rudolph - 71.5%
    5. (51) Josh Allen - 67.0%

    ADJ Comp % Under Pressure:
    1t. (2t) Sam Darnold - 67.6%
    1t. (2t) Baker Mayfield - 67.6%
    3. (8) Mason Rudolph - 63.9%
    4. (18) Josh Rosen - 61.5%
    5. (33) Josh Allen - 58.1%

    ADJ Comp % Deep Passing:
    1. (2) Baker Mayfield - Adj Comp % = 60.3%
    2. (7) Mason Rudolph - 52.3%
    3. (9) Sam Darnold - 50.0%
    4. (18) Josh Allen - 46.5%
    5. (36) Josh Rosen - 39.4%

    ADJ Comp % vs Blitz
    1. (1) Sam Darnold - 79.0%
    2. (2) Baker Mayfield - 78.1%
    3. (4) Josh Rosen - 76.3%
    4. (36) Mason Rudolph - 65.7%
    5. (41) Josh Allen - 64.7%

    Draw your own conclusions.

    IMO, Sam Darnold is the choice at #1. FTR, I like Mayfield; but I believe he needs a college heavy offense similar to the offense Pederson installed for Foles to be success (Foles sucked before Pederson made the changes). I don't believe Haley would/will run that type of offense - and Darnold would be the perfect fit for what Haley likes to do.
     
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  41. tradercane

    tradercane Well-Known Member

    I also like Darnold the best followed by Mayfield, Rosen, and Allen.
     
  42. mjkstl

    mjkstl Well-Known Member

    As long as neither 1 or 4 are spent on Josh Allen. He reminds me of a lesser Blaine Gabbert. Looks good in shorts and warm-up but at game time crumbles. He should have done better at Wyoming.
     
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  43. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
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    Lol Josh Allen just performed significantly better at game time than Baker Mayfield did :idk:
     
  44. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    Putting stock into a scrimmage? The week of practice is what is important, and Mayfield significantly out-performed Allen all week.
     
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  45. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    He was talking about games. It was the most recent common data point
     
  46. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    It’s an imperfect and irrelevant data point.
     
  47. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
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    I don't see how them playing in the same game with the same circumstances isn't relevant.
     
  48. The_QCT

    The_QCT Well-Known Member
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    1. Same circumstances? So the personnel was the same on both sides of the ball for both? The same exact plays were ran by both the offense and defense for both?

    The answers are no...the circumstances were not the same. It’s impossible to have the same circumstances unless it’s an absolutely controlled scrimmage.

    2. It’s a scrimmage...it means little-to-nothing. The teams, scouts and front offices are there to primarily obvserve the week of practice...provides a lot more relevant data than the actual game.
     
  49. Arkadin

    Arkadin inefficiently efficent and unclearly clear
    Donor

    I understand what the senior bowl is. Howver it's still a competitive football game where player a did nothing and player b didn't 'crumble'