i've been reading some of the forums on westeros.org and some posters over there have a theory that it was the citadel that was behind the dragons dying out and the end of house targaryen. anyone know more about this?
I definitely think we're about to find out that there's some shady stuff going on at the Citadel. not sure if it's related to killing the dragons though.
the stuff i've been reading is pretty deep and i don't believe some of it. some of the conspiracy theorists claim that the maesters, at the command of the archmaesters at the citadel, were advising their respective lords to raise up against the targaryens. great houses rarely married into one another, but in one year you have a stark betrothed to a tully, a baratheon to a stark, a tully to a lannister, all while eddard and robert are being fostered at the vale.
these two talk about it a lot: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/61308-what-was-really-behind-roberts-rebellion/ http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/53665-adwd-spoilers-varys-and-the-citadel/
just started reading about Varys, and two things that jump out to me immediately is 1. doesn't Varys use magic? didn't Tyrion discover that he used a counter gravity spell to move the bed and get to the secret passage in the Red Keep? and 2. if Varys is helping rid the world of dragons and the Targaryens, why would he be trying to clear the way for Aegon's return? even if he is an impostor, their plan still seems to be to unite him with Dany, right? I'm gonna keep reading though. Sundays are so boring without football.
that's what seemed so odd and wrong to me. i know lady ryswell hated maester walys and called maesters grey rats. her conversation to theon about rickard's "southron ambitions" seem to be the only basis for this
yea unless there is some other writing that I'm not aware of, I feel like they're making a shitload of assumptions.
Tyrion was making a joke. Shae said it magically rose from the ground. Tyron said sarcastically that it was a counterweight spell. He just meant that there was an unseen counterweight that would be engaged when varys pulled a lever.
lol at the ppl on that website that act this is written history. Its a really good story but jeez some ppl take it way to far.
I just posted this in the book 5 thread but I forgot about this part from the end of book 4 about Marwyn.
Plus I feel like most maesters are anti-magic. Luwin was always shooting down Nan's stories. Aemon was definitely unique in his embracing old stories and magic.
I've seen that too, and I think it is tied in with the quote that keeps coming up about how sorcery is a sword without a sheath. Dragons bring magic/sorcery. Magic/sorcery are impossible to harness once unleashed, and is therefore a huge danger to the world. Kill dragons, kill magic. Kill dragons, remove a huge danger to humanity. The best example in our lives is Religious leaders trying to stop scientific discovery (stem cells, cloning, etc.), which would put the archmaesters on the wrong side in my opinion. While sorcery may be dangerous, experimentation and learning may lead to methods of controlling it, which would be of a greater long term benefit to humanity. Marwyn is like a Galileo or Copernicus of his time.
just noticed another small detail that I found interesting. when Ghost leads Jon to the dragonglass near the Fist of the First Men, Jon remarks that it's called dragonglass, but the Maesters call it obsedian. interesting that the Maesters go out of their way to call it something that does not refer to dragons.
interesting...will read those linked threads from westeros. I always had a feeling that The Citadel would have a bigger impact in the overall story
Some posters believe their theories so much they believe them to be absolute fact. I'm not saying they're baseless, but they believe them as if they were absolute facts
Didn't Ned read, in the book about the lineages of all the houses in Westeros, about multiple times when Baratheons married Lannisters? He figured Joff wasn't a Baratheon because all the prior times that Baratheons and Lannisters hooked up the Baratheon dark hair was the dominant gene, plus all of Robert's bastards had dark hair. Do we really know that it was uncommon for powerful houses to intermarry?
yes because no lannister married a baratheon before robert and cersei. with the exception of some targaryens who married martells and some smaller houses, the great houses never married
Catelyn Tully and Ned, Lisa Tully and Jon Arryn. Couple more examples but those just off the top of my head. But yeah most of the time the great houses didn't intermarry they strengthened their own position by marrying bannermen.
the only exception i can find of a great house marrying into each other before the events surrounding robert's rebellion (other than targaryen/martell) is when robert's grandfather married a targaryen
Never though about it that way, when you hear about the older generations the great lords usually married the daughters of the lords that paid fealty to them (Mace tyrell's mom was a Redwyne, Ned's mother was a Flint ect). Interesting.
The quote is sorcery is a sword without a hilt, and it's not unique to asoiaf. It means that it is difficult to wield as well as being extremely dangerous for the user as well as the intended target.
and I think it's ridiculous that the Martell's thought Oberyn had a realistic shot at marrying Cersei. he wasn't even the heir to Dorne. Tywin would never go for that.
From what I gather, Joanna had Tywin by the balls because of how much he loved her. It was her that arranged it and Tywin only rejected it because Joanna died before their(Edit: The Martells) arrival... I'm guessing thats when he got the illusions of grandeur of her marrying Rhaegar.